after nuke school ... what's a nuke's schedule

[rnhouston]

Help! my daughter started at goose creek at the beginning of april. She's almost done with the first leg and, although they say the pace of the classes is like "drinking from a fire hose", she's gotten through it. However, she is becoming disillussioned with the navy because she's now finding out what really happens after after final graduation and deployment is nothing like her recuiter said it would be. Her recuiter told her that a year at sea was the standard followed by shore duty (somewhere in the world) with a possible 2nd sea duty of 6 months occuring during her remaining enlistment. She has had some of her instructors telling her that it's 9 months for her 1st sea duty followed by additional sea duty of 9-12 months evry 18 months. They tell her that during her sea time, there are no days off and no family contact except for snail mail. They are telling her that they hated it and women are judged more strictly (this came from a female intructor). In addition, she's told that during her shore duty, every 3rd day is a 24 hour "watch day " (i think she called it) with very limited liberty. I don't know whether these instructors and other officers that she's gone to speak with are being candid and telling her the truth or really bitter about their navy experiences but they have her so angry about mislead thet she's loosing her focus and intensity and possibly sabbotaging her chances of completing the program. She and her fiance made plans for the timing of their wedding and starting their family based on the recruiter's information of how her enlistment would play out.

She has talked to the chaplain and has had several meetings with other officers and NCO's regarding this trying to get the straight dope on what her life will be during the rest of her enlistment and has said that they all tell pretty much the same story. As a mom, I feel so helpless for the first time in my life.Her rucruiter is no longer at that post. Other recruiters beat around the bush and won"t give me any concrete answers. Their CO's will not return my calls. I know that the navy or the co's at goose creek won't discuss anything with me and can"t expect them to. You other moms are all i have left! Please, some one tell me what happens after nuke school. You"re the most trustworthy and I know that you can tell me what she should . I can't stand the thought of her washing out because of invalid info or misunderstanding.

[elizabeth77(USS SAN FRANCISCO)]

My son has been stationed in San Diego for a little over three months now.  He works six twelve hour days and it is true that he has a 24 hour watch day every so often.  I'm not sure when.  He is on a sub.  When the sub is underway or on deployment there really is no time off especially in the beginning before they get their dolphins.  This does not usually happen for 9 to 12 months.  So, really these nukes are in "school" for three years.  He does not complain but he does tell me when he gets a job outside of the Navy it will feel sooooooooo different.  When he goes back to school he will end up laughing at anyone who complains about the work load. On the sub they can sleep for six hour shifts. 

If I counseled anyone that wanted to go into the Navy I would encourage them to look up online facebook pages and other resources to talk to actual Navy enlisted men and women to get the "real" scoop.  Nukes are a different breed, work harder longer hours depending on whether they are MMs, ETs or the other titles that slip my memory here.  It also depends on whether you are sub or carrier.  Others here will most likely respond and tell their story.  I wish her luck. 

[Gulf Coast Mom]

Mhouston - my son is on a sub, so not sure how much help I will be.  I will tell you that I would not even try to plan a wedding while still in school.  Even after, things change frequently.  My son does have duty every three or four days while in port depending on the staffing in his dept. at that time.  Say he has duty on Monday, he report at 7:00 Monday for normal duty, at 16:00 the rest of the guys go home, he stays with the other "on duty" sailors.  He may actually only have a 4 or 6 hour duty watch during the night - say midnight to 4am, but has to stay on the "boat" during the whole time.  At some point, he sleeps a few hours. Then, at 7:00 everyone comes back for the day shift, so he is then there for the rest of the day.  At 16:00 he gets to leave and go home (if everything is running OK and they are not trying to get ready for an underway).  So, he will have Tuesday night at home, work a normal day Wednesday, go home at normal time, come in Thursday morning - will have duty that night, so the schedule starts over again.  He did well in school, and I think basically likes what he does, but especially being on a sub, says it is no life for a marriage, That being said, I think there are many young couples that make it work, with the women left at home forming their own "family and support groups".  Not sure how that would work when it is  your daughter being the one "at sea" and the husband left at home. I do think the communciation on a carrier is somewhat better than on a sub (just went 28 days without a word - no e-mail, Skype, snail mail, phone, etc), but still not like she would be working at the office down the street.  Recruiters are "salesman".  My son was counting "on seeing the world".  So far, he has seen parts of the eastern United States he had never seen, been in Rota Spain for 2 days and evenings and spent a part of two days and evenings in Caracua (sp) - he had duty, so did not have but a few hour off the boat.  He has been in 4-1/2 years - is not planning to reenlist, even with the big bonuses offered.  There have been more times than I can count where he has planned a trip either home or just a long weekend with Navy buddies that have had to be cancelled or changed due to last minute "needs of the Navy".  I'm sure someone else will come along with some other comments, but is sounds like what the recruiter told her is not a realistic depiction of a Navy Nuke.

[Binker & Bro: 2X Nuke Mom]

First, as a woman who was in the military in a historically male field, I can tell you that women in the military walk a rough road period. It is reality unless she is someone in a high visibility job with a high visibility boss. It sucks; its not fair; but it is what it is. Rock Center wouldnt be running a program the ramifications of military life for women (tonight) if it were not still a difficult road to walk--even 20 years after I did it.

 

Second, with the changing nature of the world order, nothing is as it should be. My son just finished MM school in Apr and was assigned to the Stennis at the end of May. They were supposed to go out on a four month tour in Jan with the boat going into dry dock after. They were turned around and sent back to the Persian Bulf in August for at least 9 months.

 

As said before, recruiters are salespersons., They get bonuses for bagging a Nuke. While on carriers, they have access to internet, I havent heard from my boy in 3 weeks and it was one line that said he was tired and they were working really long hours.

 

That being said, Binker put his bonus in a retirement account at 20 and is set. He made E-4 in 4 months and will put on E-5 very soon. He has been in 21/2 years. I took 5 years to make E-5. With the military, there is a give and take. Binker followed his mother, his uncles and his grandfather. His brother leaves in April to become my second nuke. It is in our blood. Try calling the ombudsman. They have the direct line to the commander but again reality check--she is an adult and she put her hand in the air.

 

Hope this helps and doesnt sound cynical. It's not. Military life is a life of sacrifice and unfortunately, many of our kids these days have ever had to put their wants second to the wants and needs of others. I have spent 17 years teaching high school kids so I have a little insight into their ways of thinking. And again, I am not being cynical. It is our family business.

[Mark]

Recruiters are definitely known to lie on occasion, though often they are just uninformed about other communities in the Navy, and aren't concerned about talking about stuff they know little or nothing about.  That said, it appears from your post that part of the disconnect is some confusion about "sea duty", as opposed to being "at sea", or on deployment.  I have to assume that you are really asking about what your daughter's life will be like after prototype, than the Power School.  So, here's the deal - unless she is one of the 10% of prototype graduates picked up for two years of staff duty at prototype after her class graduates from prototype, the rest of her six year enlistment WILL be on "sea duty".  By the way, if she were to be picked up for prototype staff, she will be required to extend her enlistment for two years, meaning she would still have roughly a four year stretch of sea duty.  Sea duty simply means they are assigned to a ship.  As a female, she will be assigned to an aircraft carrier, while some female officer nucs are being assigned to a few submarines, there are no firm plans at this point to put enlisted females on subs, though I suspect they will around the time your daughter's first enlistment is ending.  Unless the carrier she is assigned is in a refueling overhaul, she will spend 60-70% of her time actually at sea, for up to nine months at a time.  Only one carrier at a time is in refueling, currently that is the Abraham Lincoln, for about 2 1/2 years.  Next up will be the George Washington, in about two year's time - that ship is currently homeported in Japan, by the way.  The Enterprise is also about to be decommissioned and defueled, which will still require a lot of nucs, but I suspect that by the time your daughter finishes prototype, they won't be sending any more nucs there, but I could be wrong on that. Carrier duty is generally less arduous than submarine duty, at least as far as hours spent on board when in port.  She would have a duty day every fourth or fifth day, where she would be on the ship for a full 24 hours, plus most of the following workday (unless its a weekend or holiday).  The only time she would be on three-section duty, which is what it's called when you have duty every third day, would be if the ship were in a particularly intense inport upkeep period.  Being in port does NOT mean lots of time off - there is plenty of maintenance, watch-standing and training to be done when the ship is in port.  As far as females having it tougher - I rather doubt it, but obviously, I haven't experienced that.  On a carrier, she will have frequent access to email, and will be able to Skype at times as well, I would think.  She will definitely have more communication underway than submariners have, and will also have the opportunity to take a large variety of college classes underway.  The life of a nuc in the fleet is definitely not an easy one, disillusionment is a common feeling among nucs.  It is definitely tolerable though, and she will have foreign port visits - the ones who don't visit any ports are those on SSBNs (boomers, or ballistic missile, i.e. "Trident" submarines).  Basically, the vast majority of Navy sailors (especially the nucs) have to learn to suck it up, and make the best of their enlistment.  Learning how to do this, and maintain one's professionalism is the trick, and the rewards of succeeding are great.  Ex-nucs do extremely well after their enlistment, and - if they choose to stay in, it does get better with seniority.

[Mark]

Something I should add, to add balance, along the lines of some past posts that are buried by now is...

even though it is never what they expected going in, it is still a real kick in the a$$ to operate a Navy nuclear power plant.  The ones who make it a positive experience overall are the ones who get that, and appreciate it - cuz that is where the short-term reward mostly is.  

My first underway on a fast attack out of Mare Island, CA; mid-80s.  My whole time so far from leaving the pier to going downriver and halfway down SF Bay to Alameda, where we tie-up for several hours to onload torpedos has been spent on the "maneuvering watch", where, on submarines, everyone is assigned a spot during the period that a submarine is most at risk - on the surface, in heavy traffic.  For a nub on the boat, it's damage control party, stationed on the mess decks (where meals are served).  We're a mix of a few senior persons, but mostly , it's the nubs who aren't qualified to stand any "real" watches yet.  The point is... I'm not yet anywhere near the engine room while the boat is underway - I'm just hangin' on the mess decks with the other nubs.  So finally, we're out past the Golden Gate, but still on the surface heading out towards the dive point where the continental shelf ends, when the maneuvering watch is finally secured, and those not on watch (like me) can roam the boat..Finally my opportunity to see the propulsion plant in operation at sea on a submarine.  We're at some speed now, probably answering a full bell on the throttles, and the boat is in a rhythmic rolling motion  from the propulsion shaft and screw pushing against the water.  The memory is still clear as day, having gone all the way aft on the boat, past the main engines, to shaft alley, where I just marveled at my first sight of the main propulsion shaft, powerfully churning away, producing the rhythm that is transmitted through the entire boat.  And that display of power is close to being silent, just the low thrumm of the shaft this far back on the boat, past where you hear the electric motors driving all the different pumps of various systems.

Point is - it can still be fun and interesting, even when you are busting you a$$ under frustrating circumstances.

[MN Mom of MM]

Just a little added info.  My sailor's recruiter was a Nuc.  The first letter I got in from sailor in BC stated  "...(____) didn't really explain what this was REALLY like....  I know he was not truthful and upfront about a lot of things.  Must be the bonus for Nuc enlistment thing.  I would say tho to continue to be positive, encourage your sailor, and remind her it is not a lifetime committment.  There was a begining point  and there is an end point.

[rnhouston]

Firsst of all, I would like to thank all of you for taking the time to reply. You have no idea (or maybe you do) how good it feels to know i'm not alone out here. I know that I must sound must sound like an overbeaing, fanatical mom but I have watched my daughter go from a sailor with focus and strong resolve (even to the point of talking about extending her enlistment) to a kid who was now questioning her decision and in danger of throwing the whole process in reverse....all of this change in a matter of 2 wks. I had caught her recruiter in lots of ...innaccurate statements,,, no lies and had a private meeting with him while she was a depper where I let him know that the recruit manual was unclassified and fully downloadable and I could quote section and paragraph better than he could. I thought that the rest of the info beyond that manual was the real deal. Either way, once again I thank you all sincerely. Now all I can do is encourage her to continue. At least now I'm armed with the real story given to me by the people I should have come o with this in the first place. You're all very special.

[William in Nashua]

Hello rnhouston. First of all I sincerely hope your daughter does not wash out of the program. However if she does wash out that would be due to failure to train on her part. The Navy gave her a guaranteed seat in Nuclear Field class A school. That is an opportunity few people are given. Whether or not she is suitable to complete the program or the program is to her liking though, I am not sure is a situation where I would blame the recruiter even if he exaggerated a few things. There is no buyer's remorse clause in the nuclear field contract she is in this for keeps. My best advice to your daughter would be STUDY STUDY STUDY because now she is in the thick of it. Right now she is being paid to be a student, enjoy that while it lasts.

To answer the question since your daughter is a female then after completing nuclear training she will be assigned to an aircraft carrier for the remainder of her six year enlistment. Carriers go to sea a lot. I agree with you the recruiter gilded the lily but at this point her training command is not interested in hearing that. They are going to take a dim view of that. Seriously for your daughter's own good I would also advise you to knock it off going after the recruiting command. Nothing good can come of it.

[Binker & Bro: 2X Nuke Mom]

I agree with William--unfortunately this is a battle she needs to fight on her own. As much as we as parents want to step in and make all better and perfect, when they become adults--and by putting thier hands into the air, they became adults!-we have to step back and let them live what we have prepared them for--even though it hurts to let go. Constant contact with upper levels in the chain of command will eventually come back to haunt her. Time for her to put on the big girl panties and decide whether this is the life she wants or not. After all, nothing worth having ever really comes easy. And if nuke was easy, they wouldnt get the bonuses and the advancement opportunities that come in this career field. As I said before, I was in an intell field--I went in as an E-3 (when I was on the enlisted side) and had an enlistment bonus (nothing compared to theirs) and I didnt put on E-5 for four years. My $2.27 cents.

[Frances5901]

I know that you have probably received many answers but here is my two-cents. 

My son is a Nuke. He deals with both the reactors and the turbine engines. He has never gone on a tour that has been over 6 months. Granted the one he is on now may be longer. 

" They tell her that during her sea time, there are no days off and no family contact except for snail mail."

   They each get an e-mail address

   Snail mail is 6 to 8 weeks. You get used to the schedule of sending packages ( I just sent a package for Halloween yesterday). Christmas take longer due to the number of packages I will ship that one before Thanksgiving. 

 

She will have many places to visit. It will be different and she will definitely do some growing up. 

Keep yourself busy. I joined a group that send care packages every month to soldiers overseas. This way I can talk to other moms in the same situation. It is hard to hear "the war is over", "Everyone is coming home." Yeah right....

 

The best thing is for her to stay in school. Make plans as best you can. but don't let her washout. The years go quickly and the "after" rewards are worth it. This is the foundation for her life. Don't let rash judgements ruin it. She will regret it later. 

 

[Abbe(IKE)mom]

My son completed the two years of Nuke school. No Christmas break during Proto type school AND it was the most stressful of the three schools. There were days he thought he was going to be demoted.Thankfully with hard work and tenacity he pulled through. His hope was to be assigned on the West coast (home) but was assigned to Norfolk, VA. He had four weeks off after Nuke school then his carrrier was assigned to a deployment of 9 months.  Another Christmas, birthday, etc. away from home.   I haven't heard from him in about a month.  I've heard from others that they are just too busy to communicate with home.  I go follow the philosophy, No news is good news. The Navy is a whole different animal. You really have to be mentally prepared. Good luck to your daughter.  I can't imagine planning a personal life while going through the mandatory 6 years as a Navy Nuke ... but, if there's a will there's a way.